Luckily I know at least some philosophical basics, so I do think I understand your talking points. (And essentially Descartes’ cogito ergo sum, lead me on this extreme path of epistemological masochism.)

Infinity is actually a very good example I think, that shows us we are perceiving something weirdly. There exist no measurable, conrete infinity in the physical universe, as far as we know; even the space itself has its limits. Yet we understand the concept of infinity, so it exists in some form, in the reality we are perceiving. But then, we can have infinities that are bigger and smaller than each other… the way we are perceiving this is quite paradoxal! Or, at least it appears to us as such.

And be love now, really is a wonderful line of thinking. I fully agree, that it really does not matter, what is the Real Truth or if it exists at all, since all we have is ourselves, right now. If we all focused more on loving and less on all the bad shit, our human realities would definitely improve in multiple ways… but we are flawed beings, so sometimes we can only try… the path towards Good is a difficult one, that I also often struggle with.

Oh yes, I cannot claim I am in any way an expert on antinatalism, nor do I follow their ideology (I mean, I cannot have children, so I guess I technically do…?). I just take their side against efilism, as the latter can be extremely harmless, and I would rather have the still life-respecting antinatalists dominate the discussions about the subjects in question, than let edgy anti-lifers, to gain more visibility and support.

I also appreciate your views, it is an interesting perspective to hear. Would you classify it as panpsycism, or does that focus too much on the consciousness part, in comparison?
I lean more towards just the weird metaphysical ideas, and coil that way to that another side of nihilistic views, where I just do not trust human perception of reality. Everything that exists to us, might be completely flawed, and what we perceive as absolute truths or assign as existing things and concepts (like math, or the concept of a mindl), might not be anything else than our delusions - we are unable to know, anyway. This of course leads to all the problems of impossibility of real knowledge and all that, but as we cannot exist outside our own perceived realities - be it separate beings, or all just one - we are just forced to live in that uncertainty. Everything that exists might be just physical things, our thoughts nothing but electric impulses, and we are just having the perception of them being something else… or maybe that is just delusion as well, too, and we just cannot comprehend what form of existence the reality is, as to us it, is how it is. This way nothing really matters, or more like mattering itself is just a human concept - yet everything inside human perspection still matters, to us.

I think it is actually important to draw the distinction between antinatalism and efilisim. Antinatalisim at its core has the strong idea of how an individual should be able to choose for themselves. That is their whole justification for the thought, that they do not want to have kids, since the kids cannot choose that for themselves. That high value being assigned to personal choice, then, is in direct opposition with the dark goal, where the efilist ideology on the other hand seems to almost unavoidably lead: the idea, that everything should die, and that it should be helped to happen.

Personally I am probably a bit too nihilistic, and perceive, that we humans just tend to assign too much value on thoughts, that only exist in the human experience of reality. Antinatalism sounds like a valid ideology, if you care the most about individual’s right to choose for themself. But there are other things, that people might value more, depending on what they care about.

Oh yes, sadly we have been on a crash course for a long while now, and I do not believe we will correct it either. We should obviously not stop trying, but personally I lost hope, when people around me did not care at all, when I learned about the climate change in the early 2000s, and got really into protecting the environment and all. But I do find some solace in the thought, that life continues, even when we do not.

I don’t actually believe life will cease completely.

I saw some documentary thing, that claimed, that even if a huge asteroid glassed the whole planet, the heat would not be able to reach deep enough, for long enough, to kill all the microbes. So life itself may not die, until this planet is swallowed by the expanding sun. If that makes it feel any better.

You are probably confusing antinatalists and efilists. The antinatalism movement is about not having children, because they perceive it as immoral, as the kids cannot choose being born, and being alive means you are doomed to suffer. That position does not necessarily take stances on what you should do, when you are already alive; that requires some other ideological standpoints. Efilists on the other hand, are the edgy (and dangerous) ones, that think everything would be better as dead.

I’ve never tried it grilled like a steak, I would suspect that’d be quite different to beef.

With game meat, you usually need tenderloin or at least sirloin cut to parts, to make something fried like a steak, to really work. I eat wild moose meat quite regularly, and that is like thicker, leaner, stronger, beef. As ground meat it works like beef, just tastes different and requires more cooking oil, but for actual pieces being slowly oven-cooked in some way works the best. Letting the leaner meat simmer until it becomes softer, makes it a lot tastier.

The Sims 2. I paid for all the extensions, so quickly calculated, something around 300€ in total, back then. But I’ve been playing it for twenty years. I do not know, how many thousand hours I have on it, so I cannot calculate the price per hour, but I think it is pretty low at this point. And still getting lower.

// The least I do not know, I do not play many other games.

I like that there’s genuine conversations here, much like this one.

I completely agree with this, and especially with comment sections. In reddit, even before the bots took over, every discussion was overrun really quickly, with a huge mass of people. If you failed to take part, in like an hour after posting, it did not matter if you commented, as it was either buried, or nobody else would comment as the post tanked. So it was just pointless to even write comments.

Here, I can still jump into comment sections, and manage to have a conversation, even if the post was made days ago.

Nobody’s complaints with setting Linux up are that it runs slowly.

Eehh… I put Mint on my old laptop, and it was like being stuck in a tar, even though it ran Windows 10 without problems. In the end I just switched it, to another distro, and now it works fine.

No, put them all in a pile, and then assign them randomly to each country. Then everyone will be equally, extremely confused.

I wonder, if neurodiversity plays any role. As far as I know, autistic people have been reported to have a higher percentage of difference in gender presentation, and the number of autistic amab have traditionally been higher. Though maybe that is now changing, as the diagnostic criteria has started to shift towards recognizing the traits more commonly showing in afab people… I have not read any recent studies about it, though.

No, they are not usually written, except people sometimes doing it casually in social media, but because our lettering system is almost fully phonetic, it is very easy to write and read them if you just speak finnish. Also if you are native speaker, you kind of learn the certain fluidity in the core of the language, so you can pretty much understand the words, even if they vary a lot (except people from Rauma, nobody understands them).

I really thought it would have been cracked by AI, because it can translate finnish pretty accurately (not always…) and if you can do that, dialects aren’t hard at all, but I was surprised to find that it still cannot! I am assuming it really is, just because there are not enough written sources to teach from.

//Oh, and as a summary my main points were, that AI most definitely has not “solved” learning and translating languages, as it yet cannot even translate a lot of things, and I guess also, that you cannot trust AI translations, if the text translated is some obscure language you do not know. They can sound convincing and form coherent sentences, but the meaning can be fully incorrect.

I was just at a networking/research technology conference in Helsinki (TNC26) where the topic of nordic languages— especially minority ones—being under-represented by current automated transcription/translation tools came up in one of the side talks I attended. There’s some effort by various European NRENs and universities to train models on these languages so those tools can be more widely available to students, academics, and the public. The talk was about “Scribe” by SUNET (Swedish Research Network) hosting whisper models for this purpose.

That should be especially good for things like the multiple sapmi languages! At least in finnish you can already write in the proper “book language” and get pretty accurate translations, even though the dialects still escape that.

Also, Finnish is fucking hard lol. I can usually pick up a bit of language wherever I travel, basic phrases usually. But DAMN trying to nail the epiglottal sounds of even “Hyvää yötä” threw me!

It is usually especially hard to learn for indo-european speakers, so it is not just you struggling! Haha :)

Actually lets break it down, so it is clearer what the accuracy was. I will not talk about the mistranslations, though.

• I have come to the same conclusion as the previous poster. DeepL identifies correctly I agree with them, but fails to pick up the nuance of it. Pretty good.

• I am indirectly taking part in mocking techbros for thinking AI has solved language learning. This is referencing the previous post, so DeepL could not know that without context. It somewhat picks up I am saying AI-stuff has not solved anything.

• It correctly picks up I learned something about language yesterday and that someone fails at it, but it fails to identify I am talking specifically about dialects and fails to clearly convey it is AI that fails. It translates correctly I mistakenly thought the previous thing was true.

• I am saying AI could not properly answer to talking in dialect, referencing indirectly I am talking in dialect in the message. DeepL picks up that I am saying something is failing, but does not convey anything else correctly.

• I’m telling Google was the worst at translating, and that I found that hilarious. DeepL fully fails to translate the meaning, but translates the word “shit” acceptably, and conveys correctly something is funny.

  So what was lost in translation?

• Talking in dialect, and AI failing to translate dialects properly - Core part of the message, so really bad, that it was about dialects, was not conveyed.

• I am laughing at Googles translation abilities being the worst - Fails to convey this completely. Not a core part of the message, but still relatively important information.

• Nuance about thinking before agreeing - Leaving that out does not matter in casual conversation. If this was translation for a more “proper” thing, this could be bad though.

• Mocking techbros - This required context that wasn’t offered.

Yes.

Yeah I’ve been thinking the same. The greatest thing about these is that those algorithms and whatnot haven’t really even solved anything. Just yesterday I learned that fake/artificial-smarts can’t even translate dialects correctly, even though I thought they could. If you talk something like this for a bit they weren’t really able to answer that! Google especially was giving out complete shit, but it was pretty funny to read and laugh.

If it was unclear, the point is: pick a random finn from the street and they can translate that pretty much from word to word, even if they are from a complete different dialect speaking area, whereas even at best AI could give you only something towards it. I can only use obscure things, like this as an example, as I do not speak that many other languages, but if the languages do not have much written record online, they are not going to be properly translatable. We are still surprisingly far from not needing human translators.

//And yes, Google was hilariously shit. I managed to make couple normal sentences, without even trying, that it just gave up completely and did not translate at all, only removed some random letters.

I absolutely despise morons who smugly pronounce language learning and translation work “solved”

Juu sammoo miäkkii uonny uatelna. Kaekkee hienoenta tämmöttiissä uonku eip nuo alakoritmit ja semmottet oekkeest uo mittee ees ratkassukkaa. Miä eilispäevänä justiinsa opinni etteep tekoviksut ossoo ees kunnolla murutehia kientöö, vaek kyl miä nii luulinni juu. Tämmöttii kup vähäsennii huastelloopi ni eip hyö siihe oekkee mittee osannukkaa virikata! Kuukkels tuo etteenki se suols aenaki iha pelekköö paskoo, ol ihap hauskoo kyl lukkoo ja naaraa.

Northern dialects

Voe ku miä uompii kuulo iästä puoloo iha. Täs onnii aenakkii kolometta murrettakkii varmoo sekasinnii, kup uon monessa paekkoo asununna, jos miä pelekästee ommoo pitäjästä huastelisinnii nip miut pystyhys iha kartaltakkii osottammaa, ja emmiä ny semmottee ryhy.

Voe voe, essiä pien kuul minnuu suap loekattuu yhytääp tuommottiilla ininöellä, taes tuop aeka palajo sinnuu satutellakkii ku noepittee ilikeellä. Mut sie alloetkii huastelloo miullep nii rumastikkai ny, eh eip tästäkköö ennee oekee mittee taiakkaa tullakkoo. Kuulehha mie pistännii miu hupiva tähö viel, ja si siä voet miut esteepi vaekka kup noen pistöö siulla vihaks oekkee. Piäs siäkii hauskoo päevettä! :)

Miulla onniinna par tuntihiha ollunna jop iha mahottomma hauskoop, ku näetä kup etteeki Kuukkelille syöttellööpi, ni melekeet kaik männööp iha pisi vittuva. Miä laitannii tähäp ny kuulkoos mittee miä kirijottelinniip ja si mitteepä tuop Kuukkel tämmöttiistä huastelop.

I’ve already had great fun for a couple hours, since feeding these especially to Google, almost everything gets all fucked up. I’ll put what I was writing here, and then what Google says about that.

I’m happy to say that for a few hours it was even more fun, when you see that you can’t feed Kuukkeli, and all the noise is so fucking loud. I’m going to put this here and listen to you, not me, but you, not Kuukkeli, from this mess.

Voe mahoton ku tuo taespa männännii polosella ihannii tuntehin astikkai, antooks vua ku emmiä ny sinnuu loekata meanannu, kuha huastella tahhoi. Kuuloha, emmiä uskonnakkaa kui surukiasti tuop tekoviksu oekee näetä tämmöttii muruhejuttuloeta kienteleepi, paitti ny ku ommin silimin oekee toisti ku lähinnii testaalommaa eh eihä tuop ymmärräkkää hevovittuakkoo :)