Doorddash will take full responsibility when they return the money and stop doing it.
Claiming whoopsidaisy on social media only flaunt the position of power and the contrived desperation that keeps drivers in their place.
I’d suggest unionize but union-busting practices are very effective and the courts are against you.
True, but that’s how any legal system protects anything.
No, capital has the means to enact the legal system. If, for arguments sake, we had perfect legal systems where legal representation was free, everyone would be protected equally. To be clear, I’m not proposing any particular solution, just being nitpicky in that “that’s how any legal system protects anything” isn’t correct - there clearly are possible systems that aren’t imbalanced.
possible systems that aren’t imbalanced
…such as in the many countries where capitalism operates but doesn’t dominate politics like it does in the US.
I mean… I’ve never even heard of legal systems that allow you to protect yourself without forking over a shitload of cash, and I’ve been fucked over by corporations in NZ, UK, GE and FR. Every time I tried to follow the free legal help I was met with “no-one is going to help you with this for free” or “it’d cost you 20k to pursue this and you’ll only win 20k at most, so it’s not worth pursuing” despite the law clearly being on my side.
Not saying there aren’t things you CAN get help with in these countries, nor saying that other countries don’t help poor people in this way. Just my experience.
As a capitalist, I can stand behind this. Valid criticism.
If corporations are people, and all people are the same under the law…
We should have a corporate death penalty
thats actually called fascism but we pretend we have capitalism if we had capitalism 2008 would have all of the banks and mortgage land lords property owners all go bankrupt but here we are still subidizing the epstein class with tax payer dollars to promote the epstein class saying its ok and not arresting them all. in fact both biden and trump pardoned the epstein class constantly depending on bribes woops i mean donations of course. China communism would be better than this.
by the way door dash uber lyft all platforms in general seem to be inflating costs by at least 20% and now up to 30-40% of the total cost of the fare goes to them rather than creater developer eg rent extraction. when its suppose to lower cost and increase efficiency. when these platforms charge a huge percentage of the product it is no longer beneficial to have said service or platform around. instead it is a net NEGATIVE VALUE TO THE WORLD and all these companies should in fact go bankrupt
No, this is capitalism. It’s capitalists doing the exact things Marx predicted 150 years ago that they’d do, under the exact conditions he said they’d do them under.
It’s almost like the whole thing was entirely predictable and followed a very logical sequence of events.
Totally totally unintentional.
Pinky promise bro.
Clock in and steal time. Shit on the clock. Check your local job postings. Use social media. Ask for clarification on that last email. Walk over for clarification. Just sit there.
But note these are all good “resistance” strategies, not solutions to the problem
this doesnt work for doordash because you’re being paid a flat per delivery rate. you won’t get anything for “clocking in”
Here’s a reminder that wage theft accounts for nearly 75% of all theft. It’s literally larger than every other form of theft combined, and then multiplied by almost three.
If you walked into a convenience store and blatantly stole a $2 candy bar at the same time every single day, they’d have a cop waiting for you by the end of the week. But if that same convenience store chain steals $2 in wages from each of their 5000 employees every single day, then that is just good business.
Part of the issue is that lots of people seem to think “my employer didn’t pay my check” is the only form of wage theft. In reality, wage theft typically happens via a thousand tiny things. Things like unpaid breaks that still require work. Unfair time clock rounding that shaves a fraction of an hour off of every employee’s clock in/clock out times. Managers requiring employees to show up early, and then not allowing them to clock in until their shift is scheduled to begin. Employers automatically deducting an hour of time for meal breaks, (for “convenience”) even if the employee was working during that time and got a shorter break. Employers requiring employees to clock out at the scheduled end of their shift to avoid overtime, then requiring those employees to finish their closing tasks while clocked out. Requiring employees to “always be on-call” but refusing to pay them an on-call fee when they take work calls while clocked out.
And those are just a few examples. All of those minor things quickly add up to massive amounts of stolen wages. For the employees, it is death by a thousand cuts. No single infraction is large enough to sue over, and no individual employee is going to bother going to court over $2 in unpaid wages. But when the company is doing it at scale, it means every employee is being paid less, which leads to massive illegal profits for the employer.
We should be at the point where RTO orders for positions that could be remote should also be considered a form of wage theft. Instead, we’re at a point where every hour, your employer steals what you get paid per day.
If employers had to pay employees for their commute time, that would be the end of RTO.
Maybe. I still don’t understand the economics of making people come in to work when the companies have to pay rent on the spaces where employees work.
Especially when gas is $6 a gallon, that steals $80 a week that I could keep by doing my job from home where it can 100% be done
Bang on Carl. Did you see Shweddy’s comment above? Thats what I do from time to time to combat the bullshit. I am fortunate to have a job in this economy I’m told. So I do what I must and try to do stuff for myself at work too
I literally posted that comment while sitting in a meeting. So yeah, I do it too.
ironic
Couldn’t you even get a checkmark by just being popular?
“We take full responsibility”*
*Only after being threatened with something worse by Chad Mamdamni
“Shit we got caught. Hey have the social media intern draft an apology that says this was unintentional but that we take full responsibility.”
After spending over a million dollars trying to make sure he isn’t elected.
Old but still relevant and true. “But there’s a reason. There’s a reason. There’s a reason for this, there’s a reason education SUCKS, and it’s the same reason it will never, ever, EVER be fixed. It’s never going to get any better, don’t look for it, be happy with what you’ve got. Because the owners, the owners of this country don’t want that. I’m talking about the real owners now, the BIG owners! The Wealthy… the REAL owners! The big wealthy business interests that control things and make all the important decisions. Forget the politicians. They are irrelevant. The politicians are put there to give you the idea that you have freedom of choice. You don’t. You have no choice! You have OWNERS! They OWN YOU. They own everything. They own all the important land. They own and control the corporations. They’ve long since bought, and paid for the Senate, the Congress, the state houses, the city halls, they got the judges in their back pockets and they own all the big media companies, so they control just about all of the news and information you get to hear. They got you by the balls. They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying, lobbying, to get what they want. Well, we know what they want. They want more for themselves and less for everybody else, but I’ll tell you what they don’t want: They don’t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don’t want well informed, well educated people capable of critical thinking. They’re not interested in that. That doesn’t help them. That’s against their interests. Thats right. They don’t want people who are smart enough to sit around a kitchen table and think about how badly they’re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago. They don’t want that! You know what they want? They want obedient workers. Obedient workers, people who are just smart enough to run the machines and do the paperwork. And just dumb enough to passively accept all these increasingly shitty jobs with the lower pay, the longer hours, the reduced benefits, the end of overtime and vanishing pension that disappears the minute you go to collect it, and now they’re coming for your Social Security money. They want your retirement money. They want it back so they can give it to their criminal friends on Wall Street, and you know something? They’ll get it. They’ll get it all from you sooner or later cause they own this fucking place! It’s a big club, and you ain’t in it! You, and I, are not in the big club. By the way, it’s the same big club they use to beat you over the head with all day long when they tell you what to believe. All day long beating you over the head with their media telling you what to believe, what to think and what to buy. The table has tilted folks. The game is rigged and nobody seems to notice. Nobody seems to care! Good honest hard-working people; white collar, blue collar it doesn’t matter what colour shirt you have on. Good honest hard-working people continue, these are people of modest means, continue to elect these rich cock suckers who don’t give a fuck about you….they don’t give a fuck about you… they don’t give a FUCK about you. They don’t care about you at all… at all… AT ALL. And nobody seems to notice. Nobody seems to care. That’s what the owners count on. The fact that Americans will probably remain willfully ignorant of the big red, white and blue dick that’s being jammed up their assholes everyday, because the owners of this country know the truth. It’s called the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe it. George Carlin
Hard truth 👍 Good news is we can solve the media problem by using fediverse and disconnecting ourselves from corpo media.
We are happy in our bubble
The more things change eh?
CEOs should be personally liable for grave mistakes made by their company. Then a lot of this nonsense would end.
That is only the case if you’re the CEO of a small mom and pops business. Then oh boy, the state makes sure you’re responsible, to show the people they hold CEOs accountable for their behavior (read: they close shops for small accounting mistakes they forgive big corporations to “save workplaces”). If you even manage to get to that point, and not just being prematurely shot down with “why don’t you just work hard at <insert corporation name here> to climb the rank ladder to CEOdom?” and cost of entry into forming your own business.
CEOs shouldn’t exist. Workplaces should be owned and managed by the workers.
What makes a workplace owned and managed by the workers incompatible with the role of a chief executive officer?
CEOs exist to siphon surplus value to shareholders instead of letting the people who produce it retain it. It’s more that the CEO role is unnecessary in worker owned businesses than incompatible.
CEOs exist to execute the decisions of the board. In a capitalist system the decisions can often be boiled down to “siphon surplus value to shareholders instead of letting the people who produce it to retain it.”
In a socialist system where the workers have a controlling majority of the board, you still need someone to execute the decisions of the board. Or are you suggesting that a worker owned company doesn’t need any top leader beyond the board?
Why should it? If the workers themselves are on the board, then they know what the board decides. No need for a middleman CEO.
Are you imagining that every single worker are on the board at every single company? Even the ones with hundreds or thousands of workers? It’s all direct democracy, and no representative democracy?
I mean, we have the technology to make direct democracy work, but even with representative democracy, there’s no need for a single leader. There are many examples of functioning anarchic organizations. I’m not really imagining one ideal way to organize enterprises, there are many ways to do it. Hell, you could even do it with a single elected leader, but it wouldn’t be functionally the same as a CEO. In a socialist workplace, the leader wouldn’t have absolute authority nor be payed an outrageously unequal wage. The workers would elect them and be able to recall them.
Cool in concept, not feasible in real life.
lol what? Even setting aside worker-owned socialist societies, worker-owned businesses exist and prosper in the United States today. It is obviously feasible.
Which would suggest workers owning the means of production is compatible with market capitalism. Just heavily incentive coops and other collective ownership schemes.
Finally real democracy!
For sure. Can’t have democracy without democracy in the workplace.
Don’t stop there, the CEOs just absorb blame for the owners.
That’s where I will disagree a bit. “Owners” usually have a CEO or something similar to run the company in their stead. Imagine you employ someone, he fucks up big time and you go to prison, despite having done nothing wrong. That’s horrendous. That’s like hiring a tax accountant, he fucks up and you go to prison for it … oh wait, that’s how it works in many countries, but anyways, that’s fucking shit and shouldn’t be a thing.
If the owner has had any influence on the company that have led to this decision, he should absolutely get punished aswell. But if he had nothing to do with it, nah. I feel like that would be cruel and unjust.
These guys are killing people. It’s like employing a psychopathic security guard who shoots people at best, or playing dumb about hiring a hit man at worst. Insulating owners from the consequences of their choices has been horrendous.
The pic above is criminal negligence, and the CEO was hired to do it.
and the CEO was hired to do it.
Yes, and the CEO is hired to keep an eye on everything that happens in the company. That’s his job. Not the owners at this point. The owner doesn’t tell the CEO to employ psychopathic people (unless he does excplicity, ofc). He tells the CEO: “Here’s your monthly salary, don’t fuck it up” and that’s it. Every further responsibility is with the CEO.
Insulating owners from the consequences of their choices
But hiring the wrong people isn’t the owners choice. The owner doesn’t make any choices anymore, otherwise he would be the CEO and not employ someone to run the business in their stead.
Hiring the CEO is the owners choice. They’re choosing to hire literal psychopaths. They have every resource to research this person first. It’s incredibly charitable to even call them criminally negligent because they are not sorry at all.
I see that you’re not trying to have a fair argument, you just want to hate. That’s fine, but there’s no point in having a genuine discussion with you about this topic. Have a nice day.
If we’re hurling insults, then it appears you’re simping for your own oppressors.
It really tells you that the nobility class never went away, it just rebranded itself.
Wealth hoarding, not to be mistaken with accumulation, should be grounds for investigation, and redistribution if necessary.
“Limited Liability” means what then? There are legal constructs that exist that have not been dismantled to even allow an idea like that to exist in legal doctrine.
It means limited, as in imposed limits. No doing wide spread economic or environmental damage is an existing limit?? Also no ones talking about LLC CEOs, we are talking about c corps lololol. Take your little libertarian ass back to school.
What the fuck is your problem? Jesus you think everything is a challenge to your identity. You are tilting at windmills you idiot. How many libertarians voted for Kamala and support the DSA, including donating and voting for DSA candidates? I have my copy of Capital on my kitchen table literally right now, right next to a giant collection of Pierre-Joseph Proudhon essays titled “Property is Theft!”, surely the mark of a libertarian. A libertarian who reads The Conquest of Bread by Kropotkin… okay… Imagine being as wrong and stupid as you are.
I was literally just saying LLCs are a thing. They limit liability. You can’t make LLC CEOs suffer as much as you want because of what Limited Liability does. You have to change what Limited Liability means to achieve your goals. Sorry you have challenges. l
I guess that means I’m a libertarian? Maybe if you’re a fucking idiot you have that logic and consider that libertarian rhetoric.
Linited Liability makes it so the CEO of Activision faces no accountability from the government when he caused his employees to kill themselves. Or the CEO of BP suffering consequences after those oil spills. Or the CEOs of for profit private prisons being held responsible for all of the illegal activities done inside the prisons. But they arent. That’s not a libertarian opinion you fucking moron. That’s a fact of life. Get your shit together the next time you comment.
Linited Liability makes it so the CEO of Activision faces no accountability from the government when he caused his employees to kill themselves. Or the CEO of BP suffering consequences after those oil spills. Or the CEOs of for profit private prisons being held responsible for all of the illegal activities done inside the prisons. But they arent. That’s not a libertarian opinion you fucking moron. That’s a fact of life. Get your shit together the next time you comment.
After Deepwater Horizon, BP itself pleaded guilty to 14 criminal counts, including 11 felony manslaughter counts, obstruction of Congress, and environmental offenses, and received $4 billion in criminal fines and penalties. More importantly for the “LLC protects the humans” theory, federal prosecutors also personally charged two BP well-site supervisors with manslaughter and charged a former senior BP executive with obstruction of Congress and false statements.
Get your shit together kiddo use an AI if you want to argue with me.
huh?
TLDR big corporation doesnt need you defending it by making up weird corporate law in your head. We used to throw a CEO in jail before they owned the whole government
I dont defend corps. TLDR get hooked on phonics kid.
Okay, well let me help you understand what limited liability limits: Your personal assets. Thats it dude, it means your debtors cant go after your personal house. It doesn’t say your company can commit wage theft and no one’s legally responsible. I would be selling crack under an LLC to your mother if i could.
The reason why you’re confused and why i was attacking you is you vomited up a bunch of words that didnt make sense and it hurt my brain. The point we’re all making is wage theft is a crime, not a bad obligation. you’re protected from obligations not legal threat lol. You can absolutely be targeted and prosecuted for the company you oversee committing crimes. So what we’re all saying is we’d like to see more of that and much harsher penalties, to prevent companies from exploiting power imbalances and stealing large sums of money???
sorry bro unless you have read marx and hegel you have nothing new for me. not reading your comment. im sorry or i hope things go okay for you or whatever you said
Bro you’re not even old enough to remember a duke nukem game gtfoh with that use something from your own generation.
I played duke nukem 3d in like 1999 with some kind of joystick on my cousins computer. Nice try, though. The meme is hilarious so I use it whenever I find it useful. I like the younger generations and appreciate their humor.
They say this after they lost a court battle. They didn’t say shit while the issue was ongoing. They even spent $1.4 mill to avoid it by trying to keep mamdani from getting elected. Now they want to go “oh dear me! I’m so sorry!”
Why do they not ‘accidentally’ overpay them for once?
Here’s the thing, they sometimes do but unlike the circumstances where they underpay, they’ll notice and take it back, either directly or just paying less next time.
I’m perfectly fine with sufficiently regulated capitalism. I’ve certainly not seen any working alternatives that have worked at a nation-wide scale.
Crazy that nowhere in the world had functional societies until the past couple of centuries. Just wild.
You want to go back to feudalism?
Nope, and that’s not what I said. The claim was that capitalism is the only system that has ever worked at a nationwide scale. The fact you brought up feudalism as an alternative shows it clearly wasn’t the only system that ever worked. And just like the divine right of kings was eventually found distasteful and overthrown throughout most of the world, so too can people come to find the capitalist system distasteful and replace it. It’s not a law of nature that people must operate under capitalism.
Oh, so you were just lying then.
Show your work.
The emphasis should really be “sufficiently regulated”. I can’t see any capitalist country at the moment where the regulation is as stringent as needed and as punishing for violations as deserved.
The best countries that I can point to (Scandanavia) seem to have the highest regulated capitalism.
I don’t see any examples of countries that are not some form of capitalism, but in general, the less regulations, the worse they’re doing.
Also, I’d like to note that I said “sufficiently regulated” as the only qualifiers to capitalism, meaning I consider them pretty damn important. lol
Capitalism is fundamentally unjust. Someone who doesn’t even work keeps the profits generated by the people who do. Fuck that.
Capitalism doesn’t mean “people trade money for goods and services”
Why isn’t communism scalable in your mind? “Well regulated capitalism” is still by definition exploitation.
I think a lot of people think capitalism literally means commerce. The sanctions usually imposed on socialist/ communist countries fuels this idea by directly restricting commerce in those countries and sabotaging them.
Would you want this administration to own the means of production?
Psst: workers own the means of production under communism.
Psst: that’s socialism.
How do they own it?
Presumably the same way worker owned businesses work now.
So market capitalism but all businesses are publicly traded or coops?
Capitalism requires private, profit based ownership of the means of production. Not all worker owned businesses are profit seeking, or any profit they obtain beyond operating/wage costs is redistributed to the workers/voted on for how to use it. Without a profit motive and private ownership you’re cutting out a huge portion of what makes capitalism so destructive.
Communism (not DemSoc) is an economic system where a government essentially owns the population ruled by an autocrat, under the veil of a single union. The ML way of democratic centralism completely fails when the opposition is blocked from voting which assures total enforced hegemony.
Independent unions are illegal in China with only the All-China Federation of Trade Unions(ACFTU) permitted by the Chinese state and the Chinese Communist Party to operate.
This doesn’t sound like a good idea.
essentially
This word is doing a lot of heavy lifting here, lmao.
Sorry I should have used effectively, being ideological about democratic centralism is nice until you find yourself organising a workers demonstration against one.
You shouldn’t have commented at all, lol.
Classic Stazi - yes any form of criticism of Marx’s socialism must be stamped out and silenced
Me thinking you said something stupid is secret police?
Wow, 2 for 2.
Communism (not DemSoc) is an economic system where a government essentially owns the population ruled by an autocrat, under the veil of a single union.
No it’s not.
Every single piece of information Marx Lenin Mao Stalin points to: the replacement of power of any method a worker has, in a capitalist democracy and migrate it after the revolution to a state held apparatus above which the flawed democratic-centralism takes grasp to hold absolute power. At which point strengthening a secret police is all that’s needed to let fascism in from the back door. At least Mussolini stated his intentions from the beginning.
The whole mass of the people must take part in it. Otherwise, socialism will be decreed from behind a few official desks by a dozen intellectuals.
— Rosa Luxemburg
https://www.marxists.org/archive/luxemburg/1918/russian-revolution/ch06.htm
i think markets do provide signals about local preferences and efficencies that centralized economies lose. personally i think socialism > comunism because of that, in which the workers own the factories but markets still operate on competition;
i am also open to something like georgism which is capitalism but all rent-seeking activities are 100% taxed and give back in form of services and UBI to the population
Markets are not a function of capitalism; feudalism, mercantilism, etc. all had markets. There would be and have been markets in communist governments. Marx himself held the same sentiment about markets being effective for similar reasons you listed.
I’ve certainly not seen any working alternatives that have worked at a nation-wide scale.
Yep, never worked before, ever… except for all the places it has.
And where do you think it has worked?
The entire globe since prehistory until capitalist colonialism started spreading around the world in the late 1600s from the Dutch East India company
Oh, so you guys are doing the stupid thing where you redefine words.
Okay, whatever, have fun with that.
If you’re using capitalism to mean monetary trade, you’re the one redefining words. See the generally accepted meaning here on Wikipedia; it specifically revolves around private ownership of the means of production for the purpose of profit. Maybe you could name a capitalist society in existence prior to the 1600s, if you think everyone else is just defining capitalist wrong?
Capitalism has only existed for 400 years. Nothing has been redefined.
Who says we need a nation-wide scale? Nations are just too big.
I have yet to see anyone suggest workable practical alternatives, just feel-good masturbation like the above comment.
So go ahead, masturbate furiously to your fantasies, but I’d rather deal with the adults in the room talking about actual workable ways to improve our lives.
This is the type of nonsense that leads to twits saying “I only agree with like 90% of what this progressive politician stands for, so I won’t vote for them!” and the fascists fucking win.
Grow the fuck up, people. Jesus christ.
Work reform? We nede to string our fucking oligarchs up and solve wealth inequality. We need to use things that WORK. Capitalism is fine, just need sufficient regulations. What we don’t need is a useless communist reveolution that throws everything into utter chaos and fails.
We need strong unions, universal health care, universal basic income, human rights protections.
Not to fuck around playing with schemes that won’t work on the countries that already exist.
We nede to string our fucking oligarchs up and solve wealth inequality. We need to use things that WORK. Capitalism is fine, just need sufficient regulations.
It is impossible to get sufficient regulations under capitalism. Even if you (temporarily) manage it, the influence of capital will sooner or later erode, subvert, and repeal those regulations.
Capitalism literally means ‘rule by capital’. As long as you have capitalism, capital will rule you. And what does capital want? More capital, more power, at any cost. It will always be working toward taking away your strong unions, your healthcare, your UBI, your human rights, all in the name of increasing wealth inequality, of making the rich richer. And it will always succeed, sooner or later. Because that’s what capitalism is. That’s what it does. That’s what it will always trend toward. Maybe you can fight for some temporary reforms, but that will always be a short term solution before your hard-earned reforms inevitably get subverted by those who actually rule you under a capitalist system.
Not to fuck around playing with schemes that won’t work on the countries that already exist.
And you think reforming capitalism works? Works for whom? When has it ever worked? I’m not the only one here with masturbatory fantasies.
Scandanavia is pretty much doing just about best in the world. I think they’re largely showing what can be done. Perfect? No. But better than the fascist shithole the US has become.
I don’t see anything besides capitalism working at ALL out there.
Do you think that there r not people being exploited in Scandinavian countries? Or do u mean is ok for some people to be exploited? Bc that is capitalism ultimately.
I guess u think that a ‘well regulated’ capitalism would be where the conditions of those most exploited are more tolerable by w.e metric.
Thats unacceptable. we can create a society w.out exploiting anyone, but it wont be with capitalism.
Do you think “best” means “perfect”?
I see no point in continuing to discuss this with people who don’t understand language.
You can feel free to same similar about me, don’t care.
I just mean: we shouldn’t (and can’t) settle for a system that only works by fucking people over.
From ur other comments it seems like maybe we mostly agree, i think u just have a hard time (understandably) envisioning a world without capitalism. I read this book Capitalist Realism by mark fisher. If u search online u can find it, i think u might find it interesting.
But better than the fascist shithole the US has become.
I don’t see anything besides capitalism working at ALL out there.
You don’t think any non-capitalist system could ever clear the low bar of “better than the fascist shithole the US has become”?
Fuck responsibility put people in prison for fuck sake they are criminals.
